Examples of self defense with a gun

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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by ed » Tue May 29, 2018 11:46 am

There was a reference to an Obama era study on the defensive use of guns. Anyone have the reference?

Never mind. You lot are so fucking slow that it is just easier to do it myself.
https://reason.com/blog/2018/04/20/cdc- ... t-plenty-o

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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by Skeeve » Tue May 29, 2018 11:55 am

ed wrote:There was a reference to an Obama era study on the defensive use of guns. Anyone have the reference?
Found a few: CDC Gun Research Backfires on Obama

CDC Gun Violence Study's Findings Not What Obama Wanted

CDC Study: Use of Firearms for Self-Defense is ‘Important Crime Deterrent’

Obama Study Concluded Firearms Used for Self-Defense ‘Important Crime Deterrent’

Sorry to be so slow, I'm researching something else...
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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by Anaxagoras » Wed May 30, 2018 8:39 am

ed wrote:There was a reference to an Obama era study on the defensive use of guns. Anyone have the reference?

Never mind. You lot are so fucking slow that it is just easier to do it myself.
https://reason.com/blog/2018/04/20/cdc- ... t-plenty-o

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Those were surveys done in the 90s, well before the Obama era, fwiw. Not that there's anything wrong with them, but it isn't Obama era.
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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by Giz » Wed May 30, 2018 2:40 pm

Anaxagoras wrote:
ed wrote:There was a reference to an Obama era study on the defensive use of guns. Anyone have the reference?

Never mind. You lot are so fucking slow that it is just easier to do it myself.
https://reason.com/blog/2018/04/20/cdc- ... t-plenty-o

It is tough moving around in this Maid's outfit.
Those were surveys done in the 90s, well before the Obama era, fwiw. Not that there's anything wrong with them, but it isn't Obama era.
Obama era:
https://www.cnsnews.com/blog/craig-bann ... -deterrent

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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by Witness » Thu May 31, 2018 12:41 am

I presume you're all over 18 ( :mrgreen: ), so: http://www.nsfwyoutube.com/watch?v=0h1XlsskYmY.

Notice the site where you can bypass YT login. I have it in my browser bar:

Image

and if YT wants me to log in, a click, and I'm redirected.

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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by sparks » Thu May 31, 2018 1:33 am

That was unfortunate.
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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by Skeeve » Mon Jun 04, 2018 8:12 pm

'I just let loose. 'Homeowner uses AK-47 to kill burglars who shot at his friend, cops say
A Memphis, Tenn., man's Friday night turned gruesome when he and a family friend came home to find two gunmen rummaging through the house.

"I see my house being ransacked and the dog was still going hysterical in the cage," the homeowner, who was not identified over fears for his safety, told WMC. That's when one of the two intruders noticed the homeowner and his friend and said "Hey, they are here," the homeowner told the station.

“He picked up his weapon, turned around and points them at me,” the homeowner told the Fox 13. “Two pistols.”

One of the guns jammed, however, and the intruders ran toward the back of the house, the man told WATN. By this point his friend had also run out of the home, and the intruders had gotten at least one weapon to work and were firing at the friend, the man told the station.

As the shooting went on, the homeowner pulled out a weapon of his own from a closet - a "personal" AK-47 rifle.

"I don't know what's going on but I know I'm going to defend my life to the best of my ability," he told WMC. “I just let loose, not knowing it hit both of them,” the man told Fox 13.

When officials arrived, both 28-year-old Azell Witherspoon and 17-year-old Demond Robinson were pronounced dead, according to the Commercial Appeal. Police detained the homeowner but concluded that the shooting was in self-defense and did not press charges, according to the paper.

The homeowner told WMC this wasn't his first brush with violence, and that his home had been shot up less than a year ago.
...
The homeowner told WATN he didn't mean for anyone to die, but everything happened very quickly.

"I was just fast, rational thinking," he told the station. "It was them or it was me, and unfortunately they was at the wrong place at the wrong time."
I guess he is lucky to NOT live in a limo-liberal state like, for example, New Jersey.
...otherwise he might be in a heap of trouble right now.
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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by gnome » Mon Jun 04, 2018 10:08 pm

What part of that story would get a person in trouble in New Jersey?

There are, for example, legal semi-automatic versions of the AK.
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by Witness » Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:22 am

Skeeve wrote:I guess he is lucky to NOT live in a limo-liberal state like, for example, New Jersey.
...otherwise he might be in a heap of trouble right now.
Depends also on the "how" and "when": a French jeweler is right now "in a heap of trouble" for killing one of the two dudes who burgled him at gunpoint.

Problem is, he shot at them when they were fleeing on a bike – which isn't self-defense anymore.

Interestingly he has quite a lot of support from people who claim "he did the right thing". :|

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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by Giz » Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:45 am

Witness wrote:
Skeeve wrote:"a French jeweler is right now "in a heap of trouble" for killing one of the two dudes who burgled him at gunpoint.

Problem is, he shot at them when they were fleeing on a bike – which isn't self-defense anymore.

Interestingly he has quite a lot of support from people who claim "he did the alt-right thing". :|
Fixed.

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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by Skeeve » Tue Jun 05, 2018 1:29 am

gnome wrote:What part of that story would get a person in trouble in New Jersey?

There are, for example, legal semi-automatic versions of the AK.
Well gnome, since you asked: Regarding criminal law, can I shoot someone who breaks into my house in New Jersey?
I live in New Jersey. New Jersey is famously anti-self-defense. We have the opposite of the castle doctrine here; we have a duty to retreat. What the state government is essentially saying is that you have no legal right to self-defense in your own home and you have a duty to attempt to flee your own domicile before using deadly force.

Let's just say you fatally shot an intruder. You would be treated as the criminal. You would be arrested, the weapon would be confiscated (and good luck getting it back) and you would be processed as if you murdered someone.
I believe it has been like this since the late 1970's or early 1980's, that would be with ANY gun, not even an AK-47...anyway, to continue...
...
Make no mistake, deep blue New Jersey hates gun ownership. The pistol purchase permits that we are forced to get are a huge waste of government resources, because the local, county and state law enforcement all perform the same background check. They make it difficult so as to discourage lawful purchase. It's not like PA or FL, where the police show up to a bad guy having been shot dead and just say "have a nice day".
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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by Nyarlathotep » Tue Jun 05, 2018 1:29 am

Not a lawyer but pretty sure that shooting someone in the back who is fleeing and thus no longer posing a threat will not fly in any jurisdiction
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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by Witness » Tue Jun 05, 2018 1:48 am

Giz wrote:
Witness wrote:
Skeeve wrote:"a French jeweler is right now "in a heap of trouble" for killing one of the two dudes who burgled him at gunpoint.

Problem is, he shot at them when they were fleeing on a bike – which isn't self-defense anymore.

Interestingly he has quite a lot of support from people who claim "he did the alt-right thing". :|
Fixed.
You messed up the quotes…

I haven't looked into this case, but I presume it's more a case of neo-Poujadism, i. e. urban variant of French rednecks, than alt-right.

This guy:

Image

But there are no hard borders, of course. :mrgreen:

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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by Nyarlathotep » Tue Jun 05, 2018 1:53 am

Looks like someone that would be a villain in a Tintin book
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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by gnome » Tue Jun 05, 2018 2:53 am

Skeeve wrote:
gnome wrote:What part of that story would get a person in trouble in New Jersey?

There are, for example, legal semi-automatic versions of the AK.
Well gnome, since you asked: Regarding criminal law, can I shoot someone who breaks into my house in New Jersey?
I live in New Jersey. New Jersey is famously anti-self-defense. We have the opposite of the castle doctrine here; we have a duty to retreat. What the state government is essentially saying is that you have no legal right to self-defense in your own home and you have a duty to attempt to flee your own domicile before using deadly force.

Let's just say you fatally shot an intruder. You would be treated as the criminal. You would be arrested, the weapon would be confiscated (and good luck getting it back) and you would be processed as if you murdered someone.
I believe it has been like this since the late 1970's or early 1980's, that would be with ANY gun, not even an AK-47...anyway, to continue...
...
Make no mistake, deep blue New Jersey hates gun ownership. The pistol purchase permits that we are forced to get are a huge waste of government resources, because the local, county and state law enforcement all perform the same background check. They make it difficult so as to discourage lawful purchase. It's not like PA or FL, where the police show up to a bad guy having been shot dead and just say "have a nice day".
I don't think that doctrine hangs him, so to speak--if he's being actually shot at, questions of Castle Doctrine or its opposite are pretty much out the window, aren't they? Simple self-defense. Fleeing was not a viable option when he's been shot at and his friend is being shot at.

Don't most of those cases center around what you can do with an intruder that ISN'T shooting?
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by WildCat » Tue Jun 05, 2018 3:36 am

Skeeve wrote:...otherwise he might be in a heap of trouble right now.
Or dead.
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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by WildCat » Thu Jun 07, 2018 4:26 am

Don't try to use a fake gun to rob a man with a real gun:
A 16-year-old boy was wounded when he tried to rob someone about 6:20 p.m. in the South Chicago neighborhood, police said. He approached a 63-year-old man with a replica handgun and demanded his property. The older man, who had a valid concealed carry permit, pulled out his own gun and shot the boy in the knee. The boy was taken to University of Chicago Hospital in serious condition.
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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by Anaxagoras » Tue Jun 12, 2018 7:22 am

Dad released on warning to bury son he 'shot by mistake' at Joburg school
Tshabalala was sleeping in his car after dropping off his 16-year-old son‚ Luyanda Themba Tshabalala‚ for evening classes on Tuesday. He was woken by knocking on the window and‚ thinking he was in danger‚ discharged his firearm.

He said in an affidavit presented to court that after firing the weapon‚ Luyanda said: "Daddy‚ it's me".

He got out of the vehicle‚ went to his son and then rushed his son to get medical help but there was nothing that could be done to save his life.

"This is my first accident and a painful one‚" he tearfully told the court. He said the incident would haunt him for the rest of his life.

He is employed as a security officer at the vehicle unit of the South African Police Services in Krugersdorp.
Oops. I'm sure Oscar Pistorius can relate.
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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by Doctor X » Tue Jun 12, 2018 9:38 am

To be serious for a moment, this idiot and Oscar need to go to jail on the odd chance it will prevent other idiots from firing wildly at "noises."

Or, in Oscar's case, to find some other way to kill your girlfriend. I mean, really, could Oscar not afford a ticket to Los Angeles?

Or was he afraid he would crash into the smog?




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Re: Examples of self defense with a gun

Post by Anaxagoras » Tue Jun 12, 2018 10:07 am

Yeah, I am actually deeply skeptical that the Pistorius case was really the "tragic accident" that he claimed it was. But even if for the sake of argument it was, he is still guilty of a criminal degree of stupidity. As is this fool.
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