hyperloop

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Re: hyperloop

Postby Anaxagoras » Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:23 am

Meanwhile in Japan, plans for a maglev train still move forward:

World’s Fastest Train to Resume Trials as Japan Plans New Line

Japan is resuming trial runs for the world’s fastest magnetic-levitation train that will complement the Shinkansen bullet-train network when ready in 2027.

Central Japan Railway Co. plans to begin work on the 5.1 trillion yen ($52 billion) maglev line between Tokyo and Nagoya as early as April. Trial runs resume today after the company spent five years building a 24-kilometer extension of a test track. The trains can run at speeds of up to 500 kilometers (310 miles) per hour.

The maglevs will whisk passengers to Nagoya, a city of 2.3 million people, from Tokyo in as little as 40 minutes for the 286-kilometer journey, from as short as 95 minutes now, according to JR Central. Faced with the challenge of tunneling under Tokyo’s skyscrapers and Japanese Alps, the project is unlikely to be completed on time even as Japan’s population is projected to shrink.


2027, but "unlikely to be completed on time". California's proposed high-speed rail system is scheduled to be complete in 2029.

One wonders if these are wise uses of money.
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Re: hyperloop

Postby Rob Lister » Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:32 am

Wouldn't it be cheaper to create two dedicated airports with continuous to/from dedicated flights with dedicated aircraft? Free. With personal autos waiting. Also free. And houses. Free again.

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Re: hyperloop

Postby Anaxagoras » Thu Aug 29, 2013 7:29 am

Well, the Denver International Airport cost shy of $5 billion to build, so let's say that, yes, it would probably cost less to build two new airports (although existing ones would seem to serve the purpose already and where would you put another airport in Tokyo? There are already 2: Haneda and Narita, although Narita is not actually in Tokyo.)

I don't know why. Trains could in theory carry more passengers, but is the demand really there? Plus there is already Shinkansen service between the two cities. A train can also stop at points in between, although that would slow it down.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T%C5%8Dkai ... Shinkansen

Last year 143 million passengers rode the Tokaido Shinkansen (between Tokyo and Osaka/Kyoto, with Nagoya in between), and 67 million used Haneda Airport (to and from all the places it serves).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haneda_Airport
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Re: hyperloop

Postby Doctor X » Thu Aug 29, 2013 7:42 am

I thought they shut down the Shinaknsen to stop the Ninja Attacks:

[youtube]mjmBGgEkFpg[/youtube]


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Re: hyperloop

Postby Cool Hand » Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:18 pm

Anaxagoras wrote:Well, the Denver International Airport cost shy of $5 billion to build, so let's say that, yes, it would probably cost less to build two new airports (although existing ones would seem to serve the purpose already and where would you put another airport in Tokyo? There are already 2: Haneda and Narita, although Narita is not actually in Tokyo.)

I don't know why. Trains could in theory carry more passengers, but is the demand really there? Plus there is already Shinkansen service between the two cities. A train can also stop at points in between, although that would slow it down.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T%C5%8Dkai ... Shinkansen

Last year 143 million passengers rode the Tokaido Shinkansen (between Tokyo and Osaka/Kyoto, with Nagoya in between), and 67 million used Haneda Airport (to and from all the places it serves).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haneda_Airport


I can see that mode of transport being popular in Japan. Persons there are used to it and it has become part of its modern culture.

The article in the OP postulates that Americans will take to it and abandon cars, airplanes, etc. Not. Going. To. Happen. The US is a car culture and will not abandon its cars for trains for routine travel in the foreseeable future. This is not a technological issue; it's a cultural one.

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Re: hyperloop

Postby Pyrrho » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:51 pm

Cool Hand wrote:
Anaxagoras wrote:Well, the Denver International Airport cost shy of $5 billion to build, so let's say that, yes, it would probably cost less to build two new airports (although existing ones would seem to serve the purpose already and where would you put another airport in Tokyo? There are already 2: Haneda and Narita, although Narita is not actually in Tokyo.)

I don't know why. Trains could in theory carry more passengers, but is the demand really there? Plus there is already Shinkansen service between the two cities. A train can also stop at points in between, although that would slow it down.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T%C5%8Dkai ... Shinkansen

Last year 143 million passengers rode the Tokaido Shinkansen (between Tokyo and Osaka/Kyoto, with Nagoya in between), and 67 million used Haneda Airport (to and from all the places it serves).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haneda_Airport


I can see that mode of transport being popular in Japan. Persons there are used to it and it has become part of its modern culture.

The article in the OP postulates that Americans will take to it and abandon cars, airplanes, etc. Not. Going. To. Happen. The US is a car culture and will not abandon its cars for trains for routine travel in the foreseeable future. This is not a technological issue; it's a cultural one.

CH

Yup. Bill Agee bankrupted Morrison Knudsen Corporation when he tried to become a high speed train magnate.

Even tried to sell it in Hawaii.

Depends on public funding. In this economy the states can't afford it, and we taxpayers sure can't.
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Re: hyperloop

Postby Rob Lister » Fri Aug 30, 2013 1:58 pm

Pyrrho wrote:
Cool Hand wrote:
Anaxagoras wrote:Well, the Denver International Airport cost shy of $5 billion to build, so let's say that, yes, it would probably cost less to build two new airports (although existing ones would seem to serve the purpose already and where would you put another airport in Tokyo? There are already 2: Haneda and Narita, although Narita is not actually in Tokyo.)

I don't know why. Trains could in theory carry more passengers, but is the demand really there? Plus there is already Shinkansen service between the two cities. A train can also stop at points in between, although that would slow it down.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T%C5%8Dkai ... Shinkansen

Last year 143 million passengers rode the Tokaido Shinkansen (between Tokyo and Osaka/Kyoto, with Nagoya in between), and 67 million used Haneda Airport (to and from all the places it serves).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haneda_Airport


I can see that mode of transport being popular in Japan. Persons there are used to it and it has become part of its modern culture.

The article in the OP postulates that Americans will take to it and abandon cars, airplanes, etc. Not. Going. To. Happen. The US is a car culture and will not abandon its cars for trains for routine travel in the foreseeable future. This is not a technological issue; it's a cultural one.

CH

Yup. Bill Agee bankrupted Morrison Knudsen Corporation when he tried to become a high speed train magnate.

Even tried to sell it in Hawaii.

Depends on public funding. In this economy the states can't afford it, and we taxpayers sure can't.


It seems like it would work best between two cities which also have excellent public transportation. What good does it do to take cheap and fast long-haul transportation only to be stranded at your destination. By the time you rent a car (or pay for taxies) you've spent all you saved in transportation costs. The time you spend arranging all of that will kill your time savings too, pretty much. So I can see it for some cities, but only a few here.

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Re: hyperloop

Postby Abdul Alhazred » Fri Aug 30, 2013 2:15 pm

Rob Lister wrote:It seems like it would work best between two cities which also have excellent public transportation. ...


Or between one city with good public transportation and wherever you parked your car.

Plenty of people drive to NYC or Chicago, park somewhere relatively secure, and not drive again until time to go home.
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Re: hyperloop

Postby DrMatt » Mon Sep 09, 2013 8:23 pm

If he fails, he'll be another kook. If he succeeds, he'll be John Galt--another kook.
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Re: hyperloop

Postby Rob Lister » Mon Sep 09, 2013 8:59 pm

DrMatt wrote:If he fails, he'll be another kook. If he succeeds, he'll be John Galt--another kook.


John Galt would have built the thing and then talked about it, not talked about the thing and suggest someone else build it.

:P

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Re: hyperloop

Postby Abdul Alhazred » Mon Sep 09, 2013 10:37 pm

John Galt would have made it invisible, so your kind would never know if he built it or not. :coolspecs:
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Re: hyperloop

Postby DrMatt » Tue Sep 10, 2013 7:25 pm

When I first saw the OP, I thought it created shortcuts from here to there via another dimension. I was woefully disappointed.
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Re: hyperloop

Postby Anaxagoras » Thu Sep 12, 2013 5:15 am

Who is John Galt?
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Re: hyperloop

Postby Doctor X » Thu Sep 12, 2013 5:38 am

Some self-important deluded harridan's wet dream.

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Re: hyperloop

Postby Abdul Alhazred » Thu Sep 12, 2013 9:24 am

Anaxagoras wrote:Who is John Galt?


If you have to ask ... :mrgreen:
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Re: hyperloop

Postby Anaxagoras » Thu Sep 19, 2013 4:03 am

Elon Musk's Hyperloop Will Work, Says Some Very Smart Software

When Elon Musk unveiled the Hyperloop back in August, his critics were quick to scoff at his proposal for a new, superfast mode of transporation. A number of people derided Musk’s white paper as cartoonish and vague. Musk vowed to prove the naysayers wrong by building an actual physical prototype, but that’s not expected to arrive for years.

Meanwhile, some evidence has just appeared that shows Musk may indeed be onto something. Ansys (ANSS), a maker of very high-end simulation software used to design planes, trains, automobiles and all manner of other things, has fed the Hyperloop specifications into a computer and come away impressed. “I don’t immediately see any red flags,” says Sandeep Sovani, the director of land transporation strategy at Ansys. “I think it is quite viable.”
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Re: hyperloop

Postby Abdul Alhazred » Thu Sep 19, 2013 9:08 am

"Work" in what sense?

If he won't put up his own money ...
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Re: hyperloop

Postby Rob Lister » Thu Sep 19, 2013 10:04 am

When Elon Musk unveiled the Hyperloop back in August, his critics were quick to scoff at his proposal for a new, superfast mode of transporation. A number of people derided Musk’s white paper as cartoonish and vague.


I don't remember 'cartoonish' being a popular criticism but it was certainly vague.

Musk vowed to prove the naysayers wrong by building an actual physical prototype, but that’s not expected to arrive for years.


I don't remember him vowing anything except to NOT build and to maybe build a prototype, if he found time.

Meanwhile, ... Ansys (ANSS), ... has fed the Hyperloop specifications into a computer and come away impressed. “I don’t immediately see any red flags,”


AFAIK, none of the criticism was directed toward the physics or theory of the principle. It was the pragmatism that got the guffaws. I wonder if their computer tested for that.

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Re: hyperloop

Postby Rob Lister » Thu Dec 18, 2014 7:05 pm

Back in the news.

http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2014/12/ ... e-reality/

Notable quote
Students from around the world working on the project now have stock options in the company.

Ahlborn says within about 10 years and with about $16 billion Hyperloop could become a reality.


Here, let me poor you a cup of pffft.

Not saying it is a scam, just that the difference between a scam and an honest effort will result in the same failure.

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Re: hyperloop

Postby Abdul Alhazred » Thu Dec 18, 2014 7:10 pm

But will there be free transfers to the space elevator?
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