Shakespeare busted

What's your artifact doing in Boss Kean's ditch?
User avatar
Anaxagoras
Posts: 20759
Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2008 5:45 am
Location: Yokohama/Tokyo, Japan
Has thanked: 1306 times
Been thanked: 1092 times

Shakespeare busted

Postby Anaxagoras » Thu Feb 15, 2018 12:12 pm

Maybe this belongs in History rather than Archeology but it's almost as if they dug up a new find here. An old, long ignored manuscript was found in the British Library. Apparently never published and there was only one known copy. It seems to be a source for Shakespeare though, which may mean that he once held this very same manuscript in his hands.

https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/s ... plagiarism
A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool.
William Shakespeare

User avatar
gnome
Posts: 21763
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2004 12:40 am
Location: New Port Richey, FL
Has thanked: 336 times
Been thanked: 341 times

Re: Shakespeare busted

Postby gnome » Thu Feb 15, 2018 3:41 pm

I am interested in if plagiarism was considered a thing during that time, or if playwrights and authors stole from older sources and each other whenever they felt like it, and nobody thought much of it (or tended to find out about it).
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
--Soldier, TF2

User avatar
ed
Posts: 32401
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 11:52 pm
Title: Trilobite of the Florida swamp
Has thanked: 417 times
Been thanked: 695 times

Re: Shakespeare busted

Postby ed » Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:43 pm

I think copyright became part of English common Law in the late 1700's. Hogarth was an instigator as I recall.
- new minimalist ethos -

User avatar
gnome
Posts: 21763
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2004 12:40 am
Location: New Port Richey, FL
Has thanked: 336 times
Been thanked: 341 times

Re: Shakespeare busted

Postby gnome » Thu Feb 15, 2018 5:27 pm

That could cover the legal history. There's also the question of whether literary communities (such as they may have existed) were concerned with the matter.
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
--Soldier, TF2

User avatar
Doctor X
Posts: 66383
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 8:09 pm
Title: Collective Messiah
Location: Your Mom
Has thanked: 3182 times
Been thanked: 2010 times

Re: Shakespeare busted

Postby Doctor X » Thu Feb 15, 2018 6:15 pm

Shakespeare adapted his plays from other sources, sometimes quite directly.

This may be a "lost" source now identified.

--J.D.
Mob of the Mean: Free beanie, cattle-prod and Charley Fan Club!
"Doctor X is just treating you the way he treats everyone--as subhuman crap too dumb to breathe in after you breathe out."--Don
DocX: FTW.--sparks
"Doctor X wins again."--Pyrrho
"Never sorry to make a racist Fucktard cry."--His Humble MagNIfIcence
"It was the criticisms of Doc X, actually, that let me see more clearly how far the hypocrisy had gone."--clarsct
"I'd leave it up to Doctor X who has been a benevolent tyrant so far."--Grammatron
"Indeed you are a river to your people.
Shit. That's going to end up in your sig."--Pyrrho
"Try a twelve step program and accept Doctor X as your High Power."--asthmatic camel
"just like Doc X said." --gnome

WS CHAMPIONS X3!!! NBA CHAMPIONS!! Stanley Cup! SB CHAMPIONS X5!!!!!

User avatar
Abdul Alhazred
Posts: 69345
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 1:33 pm
Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago
Has thanked: 2756 times
Been thanked: 1056 times

Re: Shakespeare busted

Postby Abdul Alhazred » Thu Feb 15, 2018 7:49 pm

Shakespear wrote plays, not stories.

And that was understood that the time.

He made his money running the Globe Theatre, not "intellectual property".
Image "If I turn in a sicko, will I get a reward?"

"Yes! A BIG REWARD!" ====> Click here to turn in a sicko
Any man writes a mission statement spends a night in the box.
-- our mission statement plappendale

User avatar
Witness
Posts: 14794
Joined: Thu Sep 19, 2013 5:50 pm
Has thanked: 1735 times
Been thanked: 2328 times

Re: Shakespeare busted

Postby Witness » Fri Feb 16, 2018 2:21 am

Interesting, thanks Anax. A wide field awaits the hardy AI/neural networks, e. g. uncovering unpleasant truths from biblical texts (at least I hope so… :mrgreen: )

There is also a kind of reverse problem: for a long time humble (or even devious) authors published under the name of revered (or prestigious) masters/forerunners. Needs anti-hoax software.

User avatar
Anaxagoras
Posts: 20759
Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2008 5:45 am
Location: Yokohama/Tokyo, Japan
Has thanked: 1306 times
Been thanked: 1092 times

Re: Shakespeare busted

Postby Anaxagoras » Fri Feb 16, 2018 2:21 am

As a legal concept, "intellectual property" seems to have started after Shakespeare's death.

Although surely a person trying to pass off the work of another as their own would have been frowned upon. :notsure:

I'm not sure whether what he did would count as plagiary even under the modern definition. Nevertheless, it is interesting to find an old, neglected manuscript that clearly he must have read and drawn ideas and information from.
A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool.
William Shakespeare

User avatar
gnome
Posts: 21763
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2004 12:40 am
Location: New Port Richey, FL
Has thanked: 336 times
Been thanked: 341 times

Re: Shakespeare busted

Postby gnome » Fri Feb 16, 2018 12:23 pm

Witness wrote:There is also a kind of reverse problem: for a long time humble (or even devious) authors published under the name of revered (or prestigious) masters/forerunners. Needs anti-hoax software.


Good thing that never happens anymore :)
"If fighting is sure to result in victory, then you must fight! Sun Tzu said that, and I'd say he knows a little bit more about fighting than you do, pal, because he invented it, and then he perfected it so that no living man could best him in the ring of honor. Then, he used his fight money to buy two of every animal on earth, and then he herded them onto a boat, and then he beat the crap out of every single one. And from that day forward any time a bunch of animals are together in one place it's called a zoo! (Beat) Unless it's a farm!"
--Soldier, TF2

User avatar
Abdul Alhazred
Posts: 69345
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 2004 1:33 pm
Title: Yes, that one.
Location: Chicago
Has thanked: 2756 times
Been thanked: 1056 times

Re: Shakespeare busted

Postby Abdul Alhazred » Fri Feb 16, 2018 12:36 pm

Witness wrote:There is also a kind of reverse problem: for a long time humble (or even devious) authors published under the name of revered (or prestigious) masters/forerunners. Needs anti-hoax software.


There's a whole field of study based on that very phenomenon.

I speak of Biblical criticism.

I refer you to Doctor X for more details.
Image "If I turn in a sicko, will I get a reward?"

"Yes! A BIG REWARD!" ====> Click here to turn in a sicko
Any man writes a mission statement spends a night in the box.
-- our mission statement plappendale

User avatar
Rob Lister
Posts: 19791
Joined: Sun Jul 18, 2004 7:15 pm
Title: Incipient toppler
Location: Swimming in Lake Ed
Has thanked: 567 times
Been thanked: 578 times

Re: Shakespeare busted

Postby Rob Lister » Fri Feb 16, 2018 12:40 pm

I think the more important question pertains to his harassment of women and young boys in his theater troupe. #METOO


Return to “Archaeology”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: CCBot [Bot] and 1 guest